It feels like the residents there treat it like a warzone, where a battle can erupt anywhere at any moment.
You’re parroting talking points by conservatives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_crime_rate
Just looking at violent crime rates, Chicago is 84th out of US cities.
If you’d like to provide different statistics, I’d like to see them.
That means chicago doesn’t have a problem?
This isn’t about other cities. It’s about chicago. Crime rates in other cities does not absolve chicago of its own problems.
If anything, you people are spouting liberal talking points to avoid addressing issues that make you uncomfortable. “Chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence because there are other cities that have it worse.”
Literally sealioning, it’s hilarious how much you’re acting just like the comic.
Are you also treating your neighborhood like a war zone? Cause if so, I’d say change your attitude first if you want your town to be less crimey. Everything looks like a nail when you’re a hammer
Chicagoan here. Chicago does have a problem with violence—but it’s really limited to certain areas. Chicago is a highly segregated city by today’s standards with a long history of neglecting and abusing it’s Black population on the South side of the city. The CPD is famous for corruption and racism, going back decades at least. Like any major city, gang activity is a major problem in the poor areas, and I suspect its in those areas that one can truly be shot “out of the blue.”
Don’t get me wrong, I love Chicago, and it’s a great city everyone should visit. But like any major city, it’s got its dark sides, and you’re right, we can’t do anything about that until we acknowledge it.
Yeah, none of that is true.
Other cities may have higher crime rates
Lol
It’s usually because of a lower population making it easier for criminals to skew the results.
Chicago is unique with how confident criminals are in shooting each other in public.
You remind me of a boss I used to have at a startup, who could not fathom why our phone bill became very high when he didn’t pay the bill for quite some time. I actually got frustrated enough with the conversation to go back and do the math, and come back and show it to him, and all he could say was, “It just feels like it’s too high.”
Ok?
If you’re so concerned about skewed results look into per-capita numbers. But it sounds like you already have a reason in mind, you just don’t want to say it
I don’t have a reason in mind which is why I asked.
It seems like nobody replying has any answers either, only distractions and derailments. I’m not sure why you people think that the crime rates of other cities means chicago doesn’t have a problem, but that simply isn’t true.
I’m not sure why you people think that the crime rates of other cities means chicago doesn’t have a problem
That isn’t the point people are making. They are wondering what it is about Chicago that made you focus on it rather than other cities that have a higher crime rate.
It’s an important piece of information you conveniently left out.
Yes, you people are asking that to derail from answering the question.
It’s not an important piece of information unless you don’t want to admit chicago has a problem with violence.
Are you trying to argue that the crime rates of other cities mean chicago doesn’t have a problem? Just say so if that’s the case.
Yes, you people are asking that to derail from answering the question.
Who people? Do you think I’ve organised a group of friends to all get on your case about this one particular question, or is it more likely that random individuals have the same issues with your question?
It’s not an important piece of information unless you don’t want to admit chicago has a problem with violence.
I think everywhere that has violence has a violence problem. Violence is a problem. Why are you so interested in Chicago’s problem rather than the problem everywhere else?
Are you trying to argue that the crime rates of other cities mean chicago doesn’t have a problem? Just say so if that’s the case.
No, I’ve literally already told you that. I’m simply interested in why you’re interested in the 25th (random number) most violent place instead of the most violent place? What is it about Chicago that has got you so interested?
No, I’ve literally already told you that.
So if we can admit Chicago has a problem, can you provide any information on what could be influencing it?
What’s the focus on Chicago. An old Beau sprun you there?
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Feels like?
This is the crux of it. All the fearmongering, all the campaigns against urbanism, against transit, against everything that’s not single family suburban white America. It feels unsafe. It’s not unsafe, it just feels unsafe.
At some point, if your emotions get the better if you, “feels” becomes “is”.
People don’t take transit because it doesn’t feel safe. In reality it’s because they’ve heard “stories” and watched the news that now being just around people doesn’t feel safe. So they say it isn’t safe. Driving feels safer because you’re separated from other people, even though you’re much more likely to die or be maimed in a car accident than anything while riding transit. But it feels safer.
People like being in their suburban communities because it feels safer. Why does it feel safer? Well, if you can buy into a planned neighborhood chances are other people there are pretty similar socio and economically to you. OP talks of tribalism, that’s the perfect form right there. Stepping out of your small area then feels unsafe because there are people who aren’t like you - and so other areas quickly “become” unsafe in your mind.
There are of course dozens of studies and proofs showing that feeling unsafe and actually being unsafe are two completely different things, but it doesn’t move the fear that these people are in. They’re already convinced. Facts aren’t going to matter. It’s why I know OP isn’t arguing here in good faith - it’s been proven already. But cities feel unsafe - so they must be.
So you’re saying chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence that needs to be addressed?
It should just be accepted as normal?
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Do you have anything to add to your question beyond the standard conservative fearmongering? If not, then there’s no use answering, it’s been answered hundreds of times already.
What was the answer?
Nope, go look it up yourself, I see you downvoted me. Go try to ragebait elsewhere.
Ok. If you didn’t have an answer you could’ve ignored the thread.
and you could be open to having a fair argument, but it’s clear you didn’t come here to do that, with your edits and constant deflection of answers with irrelevant questions. Go on, get out of here rage baiter
What is unfair about my argument?
Why do you keep answering questions with questions?
You didn’t ask a question…
What argument?
I don’t know. He’s the one who said it.
Discussing chicago’s problem with violence shouldn’t need to be argued, but tribalism controls most of us so this is what happens.
I think it’s just the snowball effect taking hold; once most of you people believe something you have trouble believing something else. It’s all about fitting in and looking good in front of your peers. Logic be damned.
Cause Da Bears keep losing.
What is the point of this post?
Obviously, it’s not to learn anything about this specific situation you’ve referenced, as any time someone tries to tell you anything, you just say “No.”
It’s can’t be to have a discussion, because your only response to any clarifying questions (No) shuts down any conversation.
What were you expecting, and why are you so reluctant to believe the perspective of people with real life experience in Chicago?
OP have you ever been here? The biggest threats I face daily are gaggles of yuppie wine moms taking up the whole sidewalk with their double wide strollers.
Are you trying to say chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence?
No. They’re trying to say its problem with violence is substantially lower than all those places with substantially lower violent crime rates. That’s how crime rates work, in fact it’s why they are useful.
Other cities being violent doesn’t mean chicago is not violent.
Does anyone here have any actual answers, or are you all just trying to distract from the issue?
Okay, so there’s a super instructive thing that can be done with this user. Look over their profile. Just sort of let your eyes wander over a couple screens worth of it, let it sink in (especially on the comments side). It gives a really good flavor of what kind of “cover” comments these accounts like to spread around to dilute their payload of weird MAGA-friendly talking points. There’s some generic tech stuff, there “imma smoke a bong fellow kids,” you know, but there’s just a very particular flavor of kind of low-effort one or two sentence messages, with no followup intended or desired, that starts to get recognizable after a while.
Of course not every user that doesn’t try to make a masterpiece out of every comment is automatically a troll. But, in combination with the inevitable:
It will reveal more democrats that shouldn’t be in office.
… type of comment, it actually does start to look recognizably different from the type of “human voice who is typing a comment because they care on some level about what’s being talked about” comment that most people leave most of the time.
If I’m not with you, I’m against you.
That’s how tribalism works and you’re clearly not above it.
I’m going to block you now because you don’t have anything relevant or constructive to say.
Another really interesting thing is the way they conduct themselves in the comments during a back-and-forth. It’s a separate set of behaviors from the low-effort comment “mode,” but it’s still a very recognizable way of interacting.
- They never come off the main point. It basically doesn’t matter what anyone says, they’ll basically just stick to the same script of two or three main arguments, and they’ll just keep saying them over and over (and they don’t seem to be interested in stopping, ever).
- They frequently tell other people in the conversation what the other people believe. Of course, plenty of real human Lemmy users do this too, the weird accounts don’t have a monopoly on it. But these go to it a lot more shamelessly and consistently (often just straight-up ignoring other people’s statements completely.) Look at the whole exchange that starts with “Are you trying to say chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence?” “No.” and really just kind of study the pattern of the conversation. It’s almost like a Magic 8 Ball, where one participant is just repeating a variety of the exact same thing, over and over, without regard for anything else going on in the conversation. Well, it’s not “almost like” that, it is that.
- Their non-cover-argument participation almost always lines up with some kind of stock talking point or other, and there’s usually a variety. Again, just look at the profile, and this time focus on the talking points: There’s social media censorship, big cities are violent and dangerous, Democrats are bad, it’s like a little bingo card. But they don’t argue for them. They just repeat them, forcing them into the mental landscape, in a little waiting-on-hold-message type loop.
This one’s actually a little bit unusual in that their messaging is lining up with traditional MAGA messaging. I honestly have no idea what’s up with that. Most of the time, they’re on a little bit of a different script (like Russian ones will talk about “deindustrialization,” they’ll be mad about green energy, they’ll obviously have stuff to say about Ukraine, they also don’t like Democrats, and so on.)
I spent way too much time arguing with dbzer0 people yesterday, and I never once got the impression that anyone I was talking with was any kind of propaganda operation. It’s not just that someone’s “not with me” and so I jump to that they’re obviously one of the weird accounts. But, yes, this is definitely one of the weird accounts.
You didn’t answer a very specific question: Have you been to Chicago or do you live in Chicago?
Understanding your perspective on a question is important to answering a question.
Stop accusing others of deflection, when you are not giving supporting information. Now quit being defensive and answer any other questions people may have.
If you think chicago isn’t violent, just say so.
Oh, fuck off.
Do you know what cognitive dissonance is?
I’ll answer your question directly:
No, Chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence.
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Looks like Chicago has the highest homicide rate for a city with its population.
Just like I pre-emptively said, criminals can more easily skew the data of lower population cities. You conveniently ignored this and posted data to support my argument.
Why does Chicago have almost twice the murder rate of Houston, the only other city in your chart with a comparable population?
If you’re trying to say Chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence because of St. Louis and we should accept it as normal, just say that.
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That’s simply not true.
Can you use different words to explain what you mean by “criminals skewing the data?” Because it sounds like you just don’t understand how statistics work.
Evidence?
Violence in other cities does not detract from violence in chicago.
Are you trying to argue that chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence because there other cities with significantly lower populations that have higher murder rates?
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I don’t have an agenda beyond trying to understand chicago’s culture of violence.
It really doesn’t matter to me who is in office.
Your words say that, but your commenting says your looking for a bear to share a slice of deep dish with.
Well, this will be my last reply to you since you don’t have anything relevant to add.
Goodbye.
Oh please let be the last of the thread. You haven’t had a constructive thing in this post either.
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It seems you’re the people with an agenda, since merely admitting that chicago has a problem with violence is beyond your capability.
I’m going to block you as well. Too many of you people came here to spout your own nonsense and derail rather than discuss the question at hand. It’s sad how much tribalism controls you, but I hope anyone reading this with autonomy can see why the crowd shouldn’t always be taken seriously.
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Do you live in Chicago? Are people shooting at you? Where are you getting this information from? If the per capita crime rate is lower, it’s lower.
This isn’t about comparing other cities to chicago.
You think the crime rates of other cities means chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence that needs addressing, which is incorrect.
Do you live in Chicago? Are people shooting at you all the time?
I was there a few weeks ago for Blues Fest.
My first visit to Chicago. We even went into a couple neighborhoods. We went to Goose Island brewery and a restaurant in Andersonville.
We had zero issues anywhere we went.
That means chicago doesn’t have a problem with violence?
